Monty Burns Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 yeah thats too high. but l think it's great we ended the match with two youth products on the pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 44 minutes ago, BP1960 said: Sutton given 8 out of 10 at right back in the non league paper. a monumental pinch of salt for all those sorts of ratings, especially the lower down the leagues you go. Probably done by an unpaid volunteer who certainly isn't going to be paying rapt attention to all 22 players on the pitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redlion Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 hour ago, Dave_Og said: Exactly that. I don't think I've seen anyone claiming that he is definitely the right man for the job but there are plenty, me included, who crave some stability. That of course, takes a very distant second place to making sure we, at an absolute minimum, don't drop again. I suppose one could hope that he is learning the job. After all, it's not a job he's done before. Trouble is he doesn't strike me as a quick learner. Neither does he seem one to take constructive criticism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 hour ago, nzlatic said: I'm not sure that advocating 2 up front makes your point for you about it needing to be 442, seeing as other midfield formations are available! Personally I just don't see 442 as a long term solution and I think we're a decent right back away from having good options to play 4 at the back with flexible formations ahead of that. As for Unsworth, I don't think there are any "inners" are there? Just those who thought he should be given time to build a squad and learn what works in this division. I don't think we've seen much to suggest he's definitely the right man as yet. But as long as we pick up enough points to stay up he won't be getting sacked. The debate will be raging again after any defeat or poor performance (especially by those keen to be proven right) but he'll have at least 12 months to get the team challenging at the top so it's kind of a irrelevant debate for now. . . . . Because we’ve tried the various midfield options other than that- and have been largely woeful and returned 2 wins in 17. The last two games have been far more solid. That isn’t a coincidence. We’ve signed a right back in Varney, and we have Clarke. So it’s only peck playing wide right that you would use is having to do a job. That’s ten other players playing natural positions. I think unsy has finally learnt that he needs to keep it simple for the players he’s got at his disposal and to build some confidence. We haven’t got the players for flexible formations. 442 makes the best of what we’ve got. Personally I couldn’t care less about the formation as long as it gets results. All the people calling for flexibility or doubting 442 for the time being are completely missing the point. We need results. And it’s blatantly obvious we look the most solid in that formation. We now have a chink of a light that we build from. I think there is many people waiting for results to turn to say- where are the people calling for his head now. . . For me it’s really simple. When a manager doesn’t get results he rightly comes under pressure. That’s the job. When a manager starts to get results the criticism stops. When he was appointed I said, all he had to this season was finish mid table. Up until two games ago that looked a long way off. If he keeps this formation and can get us to lower midtable then he will have the summer to look at players and formations again. But for now, if he wants to keep his job he’ll stick with 442- and I’m convinced he will now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peanuts2 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Fondop and clarke in team of the week https://twitter.com/Vanarama/status/1612419059190009858?s=20&t=2hmWkqVNwBvIsuT-Shl3fw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 hour ago, Dave_Og said: Exactly that. I don't think I've seen anyone claiming that he is definitely the right man for the job but there are plenty, me included, who crave some stability. That of course, takes a very distant second place to making sure we, at an absolute minimum, don't drop again. Agreed Dave. Stability can only come with some form of results. The bar is so low this season. All we’re asking for is lower mid-table, from his starting position it wasn’t and still isn’t a lot to ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 25 minutes ago, redlion said: I suppose one could hope that he is learning the job. After all, it's not a job he's done before. Trouble is he doesn't strike me as a quick learner. Neither does he seem one to take constructive criticism. It's no criticism - we all d it - but isn't there a risk of reaching definitive conclusions on very limited public evidence? We don't really know what goes on in training etc. That said, talking about 'stumbling' into a formation wasn't very bright! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 18 minutes ago, Dave_Og said: That said, talking about 'stumbling' into a formation wasn't very bright! No, and smacked off- I don’t want to admit I’ve got it wrong. Better late than never though I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Can Neil Redfearn Do It Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 442 was bound to bring improvement because it represents back to basics for British players and suits the collection of strikers we've suddenly got. I believe a direct 442 with fight and commitment guarantees we move up the table. Maybe next season we can try something more adventurous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightDN123 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 56 minutes ago, Can Neil Redfearn Do It said: 442 was bound to bring improvement because it represents back to basics for British players and suits the collection of strikers we've suddenly got. I believe a direct 442 with fight and commitment guarantees we move up the table. Maybe next season we can try something more adventurous I hate the style of play. But you’d like to think two of Nuttall, Reid, Fondop and Abraham with all other players behind the ball would be enough fire power to stay up in this shit division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 hour ago, LightDN123 said: I hate the style of play. But you’d like to think two of Nuttall, Reid, Fondop and Abraham with all other players behind the ball would be enough fire power to stay up in this shit division. You hate 442? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightDN123 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 23 minutes ago, Dave_Og said: You hate 442? Depends, I have no issue with 442 and it can be effective. Do I think it’s a progressive way of playing, and provides attractive football? No I personally don’t. Is it what I want to see and watch going forward, no. I actually agree with Unsworth that 433 would be my formation of choice in the long term. Is 442 what we need right now given the players we have and our league position, yeah, we need to grind out results so we don’t go down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 4 minutes ago, LightDN123 said: Depends, I have no issue with 442 and it can be effective. Do I think it’s a progressive way of playing, and provides attractive football? No I personally don’t. Is it what I want to see and watch going forward, no. I actually agree with Unsworth that 433 would be my formation of choice in the long term. Is 442 what we need right now given the players we have and our league position, yeah, we need to grind out results so we don’t go down. Spot on, and that’s where I’m at. Play it- because it’s the only system that is working, and we need results. Re-assess in the summer with a reshaped squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 31 minutes ago, League one forever said: Spot on, and that’s where I’m at. Play it- because it’s the only system that is working, and we need results. Re-assess in the summer with a reshaped squad. Ok so I understand a bit more now, that you think 442 is the short term answer when looking to scrap our way away from the relegation? I'm fine with that, so we're in agreement there for a change! I would like us to start developing our own style of play over the next few months though so we can hit the ground running next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiseowl Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 We are better to watch - and get better results - playing 442. It's not hard really is it? Or am I missing something - genuinely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Just now, wiseowl said: We are better to watch - and get better results - playing 442. It's not hard really is it? Or am I missing something - genuinely? I mean it is a pretty small sample size thus far... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 8 minutes ago, nzlatic said: Ok so I understand a bit more now, that you think 442 is the short term answer when looking to scrap our way away from the relegation? I'm fine with that, so we're in agreement there for a change! I would like us to start developing our own style of play over the next few months though so we can hit the ground running next season. Yeah, we need results. And it’s working in the last two games. So don’t change it until safety is secured. . . with one caveat. I’m a pragmatist and I’ve always valued results over style of play. So let me ask you this- If 442 sees quite a big upturn in form, and we win more than we lose, and finish strongly. Are you dumping it in the summer to find a more ‘attractive’ style of play? Even though it’s proved to be effective? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiseowl Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 minute ago, deyres42 said: I mean it is a pretty small sample size thus far... Oh I agree - and yet Unsworth's general dire record stretches back a fair way now - but that's ok apparently because we crave stability. Can't have it both ways (and I don't mean you personally deyres). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 3 minutes ago, wiseowl said: We are better to watch - and get better results - playing 442. It's not hard really is it? Or am I missing something - genuinely? No you’re not. Two games is the basis to think- Well this isn’t absolutely dire. If it continues and we actually go a run. You would be mad to change it in my view. You only change it, if it’s done just enough to keep us up but is still isn’t great results wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 11 minutes ago, wiseowl said: Oh I agree - and yet Unsworth's general dire record stretches back a fair way now - but that's ok apparently because we crave stability. Can't have it both ways (and I don't mean you personally deyres). You're saying you don't crave (good) stability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 hour ago, LightDN123 said: Depends, I have no issue with 442 and it can be effective. Do I think it’s a progressive way of playing, and provides attractive football? No I personally don’t. Is it what I want to see and watch going forward, no. I actually agree with Unsworth that 433 would be my formation of choice in the long term. Is 442 what we need right now given the players we have and our league position, yeah, we need to grind out results so we don’t go down. All this talk of formations depends on the players you have got. Wingers suited Argentina, but without Di Maria they might use another tactic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 54 minutes ago, wiseowl said: Oh I agree - and yet Unsworth's general dire record stretches back a fair way now - but that's ok apparently because we crave stability. Can't have it both ways (and I don't mean you personally deyres). 42 minutes ago, Dave_Og said: You're saying you don't crave (good) stability? Is it not Unsworth's so far abject performance that's depriving us of stability? A manager taking us in the right direction - whether to a small/large extent - would provide the illusion of stability (and we all know it's only ever an illusion in football). If he's somehow, despite all the evidence to the contrary, capable of turning it around we might appear to have stability for a while. Until he's doing REALLY well then we'll be worried about him leaving for a bigger job. Maybe crave something else......? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightDN123 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 20 minutes ago, BP1960 said: All this talk of formations depends on the players you have got. Wingers suited Argentina, but without Di Maria they might use another tactic. This is a worry with 442. We have no wingers. We have no cm for that matter but there we go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightDN123 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Just now, LightDN123 said: This is a worry with 442. We have no wingers. We have no cm for that matter but there we go. I’m writing this and then thinking, how the hell can a professional football club have almost 40 players and no competent wingers ? It’s madness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 hour ago, League one forever said: Yeah, we need results. And it’s working in the last two games. So don’t change it until safety is secured. . . with one caveat. I’m a pragmatist and I’ve always valued results over style of play. So let me ask you this- If 442 sees quite a big upturn in form, and we win more than we lose, and finish strongly. Are you dumping it in the summer to find a more ‘attractive’ style of play? Even though it’s proved to be effective? Tough question to answer in absolute terms. Would depend on the way we won or lost those games. If the losses were because better teams were exploiting the weaknesses of the formation then we'd need to change. I'd be surprised if 442 led to long term success but obviously if we're winning regularly and looking like challenging then I won't be calling for us to change just because I once said it wasn't the way to go! What we need to do is find the way of playing we want to stick to though as we'll need to recruit accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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