MATCH: vs Exeter City (A) 13/11/21

[Guy Branston Pickle]

22 hours ago, redlion said:

I think the actual words were "goat shagger" but nevermind. I don't see how making a reference to a camel is a problem anyway. Many people are linked to objects in their life/job/country etc. It is not racist. Perhaps you and a few others on here are what some of us class as wet snowflakes. Sorry, but in the circles that I move in, that's what you would be classed as.

Here. No one called you a racist. You jumped straight to the insults. Don't play the victim now.

[Chaddyexile84]

4 minutes ago, Guy Branston Pickle said:

Here. No one called you a racist. You jumped straight to the insults. Don't play the victim now.

I did tbf 

[GlossopLatic]

22 hours ago, redlion said:

Perhaps you and a few others on here are what some of us class as wet snowflakes. Sorry, but in the circles that I move in, that's what you would be classed as.

 

57 minutes ago, redlion said:

I find it sad when people have to resort to insults, particularly when they wouldn't have the balls to say it to my face.

 

Still not seeing the irony here are you.

[Guy Branston Pickle]

47 minutes ago, Chaddyexile84 said:

I did tbf 

Ah, fair enough. Probably a fair assessment 

[League one forever]

43 minutes ago, Guy Branston Pickle said:

Here. No one called you a racist. You jumped straight to the insults. Don't play the victim now.

Give over Guy. 
 

You may not have typed. ‘Redlion, you are racist.’  However, they’re multiple posts where you explicitly imply that’s  you think of him/her. 
 

17 minutes ago, Guy Branston Pickle said:

Ah, fair enough. Probably a fair assessment 

Right on cue.

[Guy Branston Pickle]

6 minutes ago, League one forever said:

Give over Guy. 
 

You may not have typed. ‘Redlion, you are racist.’  However, they’re multiple posts where you explicitly imply that’s  you think of him/her. 
 

Right on cue.

Oh I definitely think they're a racist. 

[redlion]

2 hours ago, GlossopLatic said:

 

 

Still not seeing the irony here are you.

Well that's debatable. Placing you in a class of "wet snowflake" ? Is it an insult ? It wasn't meant to be. If you feel insulted I guess you'll not lose any sleep over it. All I said in the first place was that I don't think calling someone a "goat shagger" can be racist. I stick by that and no amount of criticism will change my mind. You and others obviously think differently. But please folks, be reasonable, accept that people can have different opinions and don't just resort to insults.

[redlion]

1 hour ago, Guy Branston Pickle said:

Ah, fair enough. Probably a fair assessment 

Wrong again then. I suppose an apology is out of the question ?

 

[Matt]

Like I said, it's hard to have any reconciliation when the people who are committing the racism deny they are committing the racism - and maybe to add to that, it's also hard if people are completely blind to it.

 

Making fun of someone’s background, even if it's disguised as a joke is certainly 'entry-level racism'. I think it can be framed as dignity - would you treat anyone you like or love the same way? No? Why are you treating other people differently then? Respect for values, qualities and differences - if they're not up to the job, that's probably enough to critisise, but the goat thing is just uncalled for. I admit, 'Lemsagam is rubbish at this chairman lark and is running the club into the ground' isn't easily sang, but I'm sure fans can be more creative than simply animal sex.

 

Are there horses in Morocco? Why not that animal? Or the Macaque? Why is it the goat? Rhetorical questions, I know why it's the goat, the same way I know why it's the sheep for Wales.

 

££ behind paywall.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10023732/Man-fined-for-racism-after-Welsh-sheep-slur.html

 

[the_mighty_bosh]

It's interesting because I've spoken to three Exeter fans who I work with and who watched the match separately, they said we were "average", "by no means the worst team we've seen here" and that we "played decent football."

 

Whereas I thought we offered next to nothing in attack for at least 70 minutes of the game.  The first 10 were decent and we pushed in the last 10, but in between there was no threat from our attackers.

 

Exeter were not as good as they were on the previous occasion that I saw them play this season but were more solid and have started turning their pretty draws into gritty wins.  My brother said that they basically played their away formation on Saturday of 3 at the back and 3 up front, George Ray was the difference for them as he headed away every cross thrown into the box, something they didn't have last time I saw them.

 

As for our defensive unit, I've got no issue with Leutwiler, Clarke (barring an atrocious back-pass), Piergianni and McGahey.  McGahey on the left and Pidge in the centre isn't ideal for balance, but Pidge wins everything in the air so I understand why he's there.  Sadly the key moment of the game for him was the slip but other than that he was probably MotM (not a high bar set though).

 

At wing-back, I'm not convinced that Adams has the legs for the role anymore (although that may be due to returning from injury) but our biggest threat came from his crosses, the pity was that none of our attackers wanted to get into the box to attack them.  As for Couto, if you look at him through the lens of a up-and-coming youngster then he's clearly got a lot of potential, but as a first team player it was his side that Exeter looked to attack down more regularly than through the middle or on our right side.  It will be good to have Sam Hart back in the short term because Benny needs a break and a bit of protection in my opinion.

 

In the centre of midfield, Whelan is much improved from last season and looks like a good midfielder at this level but needs a more physical and aggressive player alongside him to get the most out of him.  So of course we put a player who is more raw and needs even more protection alongside him in Jamie Bowden.  I'll be honest, I was slating Bowden to my dad in the minute or so between that abysmal cross without any pressure to the wonder strike that was out of keeping with the rest of his performance, but for me it's a case of Bowden not being ready for the physicality of this level yet rather than him being a terrible player.  The problem is that currently our midfield is such a weakness that we don't stand a chance with it at present.  Cisse needs to make a big difference when he's back and while he looks like an imposing player I'm not sure that he's particularly aggressive.

 

Speaking of weaknesses, our attack. 

 

I'm going to defend Curle on one part of an issue and I can see why he took off Bahamboula and DKD.  Neither are showing their quality anywhere near often enough and the team has badly needed it this season.  Bahamboula looked lost after a decent first 15 minutes and DKD just doesn't make an impact on the team when he isn't close to goal.  That being said, I don't believe that Curle is anywhere near getting the best out of them either because, for all his flaws, Kewell gave his attackers more licence to create and the sad truth is that I believe another manager could do much better with our attack than Curle has.

 

The main reason why that double sub was flawed though was that Hallam Hope stayed on.  He’s not awful at anything but he's not good enough in any area either and has absolutely no effect on the game whatsoever.  It's a difficult role to play and he works hard, but he doesn't even hassle and pressure defenders well and that's the least he can do.  As Curle's major signing there's a fair argument for saying his lack of impact will cost Curle his job.

 

I'm now in the camp of thinking that we can do better with the players we have with a different manager in charge.  Curle has been the biggest disappointment of a manager that we've had in years and at the very moment when we needed a safe pair of hands.  Seeing as we might not be able to bring in many more players in January it might be the case that we're working with what we've got.  17 defeats in 30 league games and an unwillingness to change his strategy means that a gamble might have to be taken soon. 

 

I believe that Hart, Cisse and Hopcutt could make a difference to the team if they are back soon, but if not then Curle should be replaced before January.

 

 

[TheBigDog]

25 minutes ago, the_mighty_bosh said:

I believe that Hart, Cisse and Hopcutt could make a difference to the team if they are back soon, but if not then Curle should be replaced before January.

Hopcutt came on as a sub on Saturday and Cisse was on the bench as was Dearnley.

Stobbs started the game as did Adams. 
 

That means we are just missing Hart, Rogers and Luamba from the longer term injured.

 

So, given that the vast majority of our walking wounded are now in and around the first team squad, do you believe that Curle should get a stay of execution?

Until the end of the year/January?

[the_mighty_bosh]

Just now, TheBigDog said:

Hopcutt came on as a sub on Saturday and Cisse was on the bench as was Dearnley.

Stobbs started the game as did Adams. 
 

That means we are just missing Hart, Rogers and Luamba from the longer term injured.

 

So, given that the vast majority of our walking wounded are now in and around the first team squad, do you believe that Curle should get a stay of execution?

Until the end of the year/January?

 

Personally I'd give him to the middle of December.  Enough time for the above players to be match fit and to make an impact, but also enough time for a new Head Coach to assess the squad if he's able to make any changes at all in January.

[oafc1955]

Curle has been dealt a bad hand but is not entirely blameless and only 8 wins from his 37 games in charge is absolutely abysmal.
Even with a few of the injured players returning I don’t believe our performances will improve sufficiently.

 

We have without doubt one of the smallest and weakest squads in the division but one whose results I’m sure could be improved under a different coach!

[GlossopLatic]

16 hours ago, redlion said:

Well that's debatable. Placing you in a class of "wet snowflake" ? Is it an insult ? It wasn't meant to be. If you feel insulted I guess you'll not lose any sleep over it. All I said in the first place was that I don't think calling someone a "goat shagger" can be racist. I stick by that and no amount of criticism will change my mind. You and others obviously think differently. But please folks, be reasonable, accept that people can have different opinions and don't just resort to insults.

 

I suppose living in denial is a big part of being a racist. As much as you deny it the goat shagger term is clearly racist. I take it the wet snowflake remark was meant as a compliment was it?

 

At the end of the day as much as you play the victim the reality is you are part of the problem and you'd rather bury your head in the sand and blame other people. Ignorance is Bliss.

 

That's me done on the matter.

 

[bluehobbit]

I must admit i'm loosing the will to even watch latics at the moment. Might not even bother Saturday as it's the Mrs birthday weekend....

 

But if we go through the next next 3 or 4 weeks into December and have't managed a couple of more wins surely Curle has to go? What justification is there in him staying. Especially if the injury lists clears up. I know the embargo probably means we won't sign anyone in Jan but his tactics and insistence on 352 or whatever it's meant to be have largely failed all season. He will argue we went through a few games of not conceding many goals but that has ended and we didn't exactly build on that run did we?  We aren't scoring until the game is pretty much dead. We don't score first often enough. We don't score enough full stop.  He keeps saying "I've been here before and know we'll get out of it" what games is he watching? We are awful but his tactics and formation are puzzling. 

 

I don't want yet another manager, i'm sick of the merry go round but in this instance we need some new ideas.

[Dave_Og]

If they were going to fire him it would have been done by now.

[the_mighty_bosh]

14 minutes ago, bluehobbit said:

 

I don't want yet another manager, i'm sick of the merry go round but in this instance we need some new ideas.

 

I agree and it's so disappointing.

[wiseowl]

On 11/14/2021 at 12:09 PM, Matt said:

 

Sheep, is that ok? No it's not. I hate it.

 

Ian Moore chant, is that ok? No it wasn't, I thought it was abhorrent.

 

You claim to no offer a view, then give one.

I also hated the Moore chants when they were happening. I`ll admit to being a fallible human and, in the past have joined in the sheep fornicator chants - I wouldn't do it again - older and wiser. I didn't offer a view before Matt; only my contempt for those who use the racist slur selectively (i.e. the attention seekers who are so quick to jump up and effectively say "Look at me - I am defending our black and asian friends"). They make me puke because most of it's just virtue signalling. It's almost become a fashion nowadays - most haven't a clue about racism and the nearest they come to understanding other cultures is their liking for a chicken tikka massala on a Saturday evening. My own view - all racism is abhorrent - I just can't abide those who only see "one way racism" - which is the vast majority.

[wiseowl]

On 11/14/2021 at 12:06 PM, Guy Branston Pickle said:

Absolute whataboutism, this. "Have a look at yourselves" for complaining about racist chanting. Shut up. 

No I won't shut up.

 

My view is as valid as yours. Although we live in a country where it is becomingly increasingly difficult to express an honest view amongst all the brainwashed sheople.

[bluehobbit]

32 minutes ago, Dave_Og said:

If they were going to fire him it would have been done by now.

i think your probably correct

[wiseowl]

On 11/14/2021 at 12:21 PM, Matt said:

Even though the police was on hand almost straight away because the NF were all over this like a rash, I was shocked with the judicial system not dealing with this situation propery. What I didn't do is think, 'Ahh, well this is a racist attack so we have to allow some racism go back the other way to balance this shit out.'

 

That's a bad way of taking this situation in.

Matt - I`ll just say this. Had my post been about the tragic racially motivated murder of the black lad, Stephen Lawrence all the usual people would have been rushing to their keyboards to "like" the post.

 

A white lad murdered in a racially motivated attack on the streets of Oldham - most people haven't even heard of it. One like against the post.

 

That alone should tell you how brainwashed our society has become regarding the racial issue i.e. (apparently) "only black/asian racism matters". 

[Matt]

1 hour ago, wiseowl said:

Matt - I`ll just say this. Had my post been about the tragic racially motivated murder of the black lad...

 

Fair enough. Two things though, I don't think it's good practice to gauge real-life feeling with the amount of likes - it's open to manipulation, and it can be misread. Also, there's plenty of real stuff going on in the world to be angry about without inventing stuff to be angry about.

 

Hope you're having a great day.

[Dave_Og]

Just to lighten the political mood the predicament that Keir Bradwell, president of the Cambridge Union, found himself in after banning someone from speaking because he did an impression of Hitler amused me greatly - he had to apologise for saying that the individual had  been 'blacklisted'.  

 

Satire truly is dead - and we are all the poorer for that.

[redlion]

3 hours ago, GlossopLatic said:

 

That's me done on the matter.

 

Good. That's me done on the matter too.

[al_bro]

4 hours ago, oafc1955 said:

Curle has been dealt a bad hand but is not entirely blameless and only 8 wins from his 37 games in charge is absolutely abysmal.
Even with a few of the injured players returning I don’t believe our performances will improve sufficiently.

 

We have without doubt one of the smallest and weakest squads in the division but one whose results I’m sure could be improved under a different coach!

They were playing quite well at the beginning of the season, especially at Bradford, but conceded silly goals. I thought then that we may have a chance of the playoffs, but the wafer thin squad, without strikers was always going to be a problem. Now confidence throughout the squad ha gone, and even if they are all fit they will struggle.