BP1960 Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) A share with Rochdale feels likely to me going forward... This is just a big mess... Was from the start... How would people feel about such a thing ? It's looking the obvious choice, but what happens to the money raised by selling the BP land ? Edited February 3, 2011 by BP1960 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayItLivo Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) It's not entirely pertinent, but can we erase Shaw? Edited February 3, 2011 by PlayItLivo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Takemeanywhere Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 It's not entirely pertinent, but can we erase Shaw? As a location for a ground? Or are you suggesting something more sinister? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorrro Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Hotlinking FAIL. EDIT: Bah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorrro Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 As a location for a ground? Or are you suggesting something more sinister? Call me Simon. Simon Inister. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latics and England Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Sahme Woolas isn't still around - he claimed to be a dyed in the wool Latic in SAFE days. Must be true then. The kind seen at Old Trafford on a regular basis in his red and black scarf. I'll never forget him walking round the pitch at BP in a Latics scarf that they hadn't even bothered to take the price tag off. Clearly it was going back into the shop as soon as he left Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaw_blue Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 A share with Rochdale feels likely to me going forward... This is just a big mess... Was from the start... How would people feel about such a thing ? There was talk of a new stadium in the industrial park near newhey/milnrow and a ground share i could see no reason then and still no reason why that wouldn't be a very good idea.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldhamathleticfailsworth Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Just spoke to Mark Prestwich of Oldham council, He said that the coucil are 100% still behind the staduim move and are hopeful this can be sorted out soon, there are a number of options which have already been mentioned ie appeal, or to just tweak the original submittial. They are speaking to latics (simon and Alan) nearly every hour to try to resolve the issues, and as this has dragged on for some time and this matter is a priority. A number of other options were looked at for the stadium location but there were obsticles with all of them. Failsworth was seen to be the best option. If any one has any questions I got his email address mark.prestwich@oldham.gov.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 The answer is to build on the Clegg Street warehouse site, refurbish the warehouse as an hotel and relocate Matalan. Perfect for the Metrolink too. Planning permission there would be no problem I imagine. Another soloution would be for Rochdale and Latics to build a joint stadium on Kingsway, I know there are Football league rules about clubs playing outside town boundaries, but surely the FL would see the sense is this if it meant both clubs could have a secure future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldhamathleticfailsworth Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) The answer is to build on the Clegg Street warehouse site, refurbish the warehouse as an hotel and relocate Matalan. Perfect for the Metrolink too. Planning permission there would be no problem I imagine. Another soloution would be for Rochdale and Latics to build a joint stadium on Kingsway, I know there are Football league rules about clubs playing outside town boundaries, but surely the FL would see the sense is this if it meant both clubs could have a secure future. Its not going to happen as the failsworth project not dead yet, the club have spent near on 5millon pounds to get where we are now Edited February 3, 2011 by oldhamathleticfailsworth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Why is it automatically the council's fault when they have been only one of the common denominators in the series of failed ground projects since 2004? People who are blaming the council for this need ot realise a few truths. First, and simplest, the council and the Charity Commission are two entirely separate organisations. Second, the council did its best to assist OAFC 2004 Ltd to find a suitable site, and as far as I'm aware gave absolutely no guaranteed assurances that there would be no legal or planning obstacles in using such a site. Third, it is the Charity Commission that has dragged its heals in making this final decision, suggesting that the status of the land in question wasn't quite so cut and dried as local campaigners would have you think. The one specific point for a which the council should take some blame is in not realising that the land they were offering wasn't definitely all theirs to offer and not doing the required investigation up front to establish the status of the memorial park area. And perhaps also in not making it clear enough to all concerned that there were no guarantees attached to any particular site and any legal and planning issues would still need to be addressed. It is TTA who speculated that all would be well and the build would go ahead when they bought the (majority of) the Lancaster Club site, so I can't see how any litigation against the council could succeed. Finally, in terms of what this means for the club's immediate future, I definitely don't see promotion to the Championship as the cure all that others seem to expect. Even with significantly more tv and gate money we would end up deeper in debt if we invested in a squad good enough to possibly stay up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singe Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Why is it automatically the council's fault when they have been only one of the common denominators in the series of failed ground projects since 2004? People who are blaming the council for this need ot realise a few truths. First, and simplest, the council and the Charity Commission are two entirely separate organisations. Second, the council did its best to assist OAFC 2004 Ltd to find a suitable site, and as far as I'm aware gave absolutely no guaranteed assurances that there would be no legal or planning obstacles in using such a site. Third, it is the Charity Commission that has dragged its heals in making this final decision, suggesting that the status of the land in question wasn't quite so cut and dried as local campaigners would have you think. The one specific point for a which the council should take some blame is in not realising that the land they were offering wasn't definitely all theirs to offer and not doing the required investigation up front to establish the status of the memorial park area. And perhaps also in not making it clear enough to all concerned that there were no guarantees attached to any particular site and any legal and planning issues would still need to be addressed. It is TTA who speculated that all would be well and the build would go ahead when they bought the (majority of) the Lancaster Club site, so I can't see how any litigation against the council could succeed. Finally, in terms of what this means for the club's immediate future, I definitely don't see promotion to the Championship as the cure all that others seem to expect. Even with significantly more tv and gate money we would end up deeper in debt if we invested in a squad good enough to possibly stay up. It might be specific point, but it is an important one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex_balls Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 The answer is to build on the Clegg Street warehouse site, refurbish the warehouse as an hotel and relocate Matalan. Perfect for the Metrolink too. Planning permission there would be no problem I imagine. Another soloution would be for Rochdale and Latics to build a joint stadium on Kingsway, I know there are Football league rules about clubs playing outside town boundaries, but surely the FL would see the sense is this if it meant both clubs could have a secure future. Been saying the above 2 for years, the Matalan site would be perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 How big is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creepy Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 the matalan site isnt big enough according to the club Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laticsbiffo Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 After reading the statement on OAFC official board I sent the following email to my local councillors Bashforth and Harrison: "Councillors, I write regarding today’s ruling by the Charity Commission with regards to the Charitable Land Swap in Failsworth. I quote from a council statement: “Oldham Council has expressed ‘disappointment’ at a new ruling from the Charity Commission”. Disappointment, disa-flipping-ppointment. Disappointment is not a word I am using for this decision. Disgusting is the clean one that I will share with you. This ruling nigh on kills off Oldham Athletic Football Club and I fear that Oldham’s last remaining professional sporting club will cease to exist in the very near future, and go the same way as the Oldham Roughyeds have had to go in becoming semi professional after being stitched up by Oldham Council. Does Oldham Council actually comprehend how important a role Oldham Athletic is to the awareness of the town by rest of the country. Every other week hundreds (sometimes thousands) of visitors come to our town purely because they are following their team to Oldham. They spend disposable income in our town! Not just at the football club but in the bars and pubs around the ground, in the newsagents getting their snacks for at the game, in the nightclubs and hotels if their trip involves an overnight stop! Do they even care!!! I fear not. The plan to swap the charitable land I believe was hatched by the council. They were confident that this would be a successful way to move the planning issues forward. Now this has failed, and I would like to know whether the failure was due to ignorance, negligence, or incompetence of our council officials. Which is it please? What are the people of Oldham paying for through their taxes. Is this to be another high profile failure of our elected officials as in the Vance Miller fiasco. Who’s head will roll for this one. Nobody’s I suspect! Can you urgently find out what moves Oldham council are planning to take on this issue. Is an appeal process an option, or can the charitable swap planned be amended as in any other planning application and re-submitted?" I have since received the following from Councillor Bashforth: Dear Sir, I cannot agree with you more on how badly this affair has been run, indeed although I have not yet had sight of the Charity Commission's report, I do understand that it is highly critical of the way Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group conducted themselves throughout the process. The importance of a viable well attended football club is not lost on the Oldham Labour Group who have pledged real support for the club when they are in a position to do so and the leader of our group has been, and remains in very close contact with directors of the club. I don't believe there is any appeal process here and that the decision is final. The only alternative would be for the club to stay at Boundary Park or seek a new site (which I believe to be OAFC's preference) and I do understand other sites are now being looked at and considered at, but am not privy to the details, which would in any case be highly confidential at this stage. As with the Vance Miller case, this will be a another high profile, expensive failure for Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group and it may be that resignations would be in order! Regards Councillor Steven Bashforth (Royton South Ward) It sounds very much like another council cock up to me!!!!!! This is very depressing! KTF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singe Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Been saying the above 2 for years, the Matalan site would be perfect. Needs to be 30 acres with all the footbal pitches for the revenue stream. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 After reading the statement on OAFC official board I sent the following email to my local councillors Bashforth and Harrison: "Councillors, I write regarding today’s ruling by the Charity Commission with regards to the Charitable Land Swap in Failsworth. I quote from a council statement: “Oldham Council has expressed ‘disappointment’ at a new ruling from the Charity Commission”. Disappointment, disa-flipping-ppointment. Disappointment is not a word I am using for this decision. Disgusting is the clean one that I will share with you. This ruling nigh on kills off Oldham Athletic Football Club and I fear that Oldham’s last remaining professional sporting club will cease to exist in the very near future, and go the same way as the Oldham Roughyeds have had to go in becoming semi professional after being stitched up by Oldham Council. Does Oldham Council actually comprehend how important a role Oldham Athletic is to the awareness of the town by rest of the country. Every other week hundreds (sometimes thousands) of visitors come to our town purely because they are following their team to Oldham. They spend disposable income in our town! Not just at the football club but in the bars and pubs around the ground, in the newsagents getting their snacks for at the game, in the nightclubs and hotels if their trip involves an overnight stop! Do they even care!!! I fear not. The plan to swap the charitable land I believe was hatched by the council. They were confident that this would be a successful way to move the planning issues forward. Now this has failed, and I would like to know whether the failure was due to ignorance, negligence, or incompetence of our council officials. Which is it please? What are the people of Oldham paying for through their taxes. Is this to be another high profile failure of our elected officials as in the Vance Miller fiasco. Who’s head will roll for this one. Nobody’s I suspect! Can you urgently find out what moves Oldham council are planning to take on this issue. Is an appeal process an option, or can the charitable swap planned be amended as in any other planning application and re-submitted?" I have since received the following from Councillor Bashforth: Dear Sir, I cannot agree with you more on how badly this affair has been run, indeed although I have not yet had sight of the Charity Commission's report, I do understand that it is highly critical of the way Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group conducted themselves throughout the process. The importance of a viable well attended football club is not lost on the Oldham Labour Group who have pledged real support for the club when they are in a position to do so and the leader of our group has been, and remains in very close contact with directors of the club. I don't believe there is any appeal process here and that the decision is final. The only alternative would be for the club to stay at Boundary Park or seek a new site (which I believe to be OAFC's preference) and I do understand other sites are now being looked at and considered at, but am not privy to the details, which would in any case be highly confidential at this stage. As with the Vance Miller case, this will be a another high profile, expensive failure for Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group and it may be that resignations would be in order! Regards Councillor Steven Bashforth (Royton South Ward) It sounds very much like another council cock up to me!!!!!! This is very depressing! KTF Bashforth is talking out of his arse and of course being in opposition he's going to agree with every word to beat the present Condem run council BUT if you read the OFFICIAL statements from both club, Council and CC there is an appeals process but before that they are willing to look at a properly submitted proposal. Bashforth was the cock that caused delay after delay with the Oldham Arena... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorrro Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Is Steven Bashforth a Labour councillor by any chance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singe Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) After reading the statement on OAFC official board I sent the following email to my local councillors Bashforth and Harrison: "Councillors, I write regarding today’s ruling by the Charity Commission with regards to the Charitable Land Swap in Failsworth. I quote from a council statement: “Oldham Council has expressed ‘disappointment’ at a new ruling from the Charity Commission”. Disappointment, disa-flipping-ppointment. Disappointment is not a word I am using for this decision. Disgusting is the clean one that I will share with you. This ruling nigh on kills off Oldham Athletic Football Club and I fear that Oldham’s last remaining professional sporting club will cease to exist in the very near future, and go the same way as the Oldham Roughyeds have had to go in becoming semi professional after being stitched up by Oldham Council. Does Oldham Council actually comprehend how important a role Oldham Athletic is to the awareness of the town by rest of the country. Every other week hundreds (sometimes thousands) of visitors come to our town purely because they are following their team to Oldham. They spend disposable income in our town! Not just at the football club but in the bars and pubs around the ground, in the newsagents getting their snacks for at the game, in the nightclubs and hotels if their trip involves an overnight stop! Do they even care!!! I fear not. The plan to swap the charitable land I believe was hatched by the council. They were confident that this would be a successful way to move the planning issues forward. Now this has failed, and I would like to know whether the failure was due to ignorance, negligence, or incompetence of our council officials. Which is it please? What are the people of Oldham paying for through their taxes. Is this to be another high profile failure of our elected officials as in the Vance Miller fiasco. Who’s head will roll for this one. Nobody’s I suspect! Can you urgently find out what moves Oldham council are planning to take on this issue. Is an appeal process an option, or can the charitable swap planned be amended as in any other planning application and re-submitted?" I have since received the following from Councillor Bashforth: Dear Sir, I cannot agree with you more on how badly this affair has been run, indeed although I have not yet had sight of the Charity Commission's report, I do understand that it is highly critical of the way Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group conducted themselves throughout the process. The importance of a viable well attended football club is not lost on the Oldham Labour Group who have pledged real support for the club when they are in a position to do so and the leader of our group has been, and remains in very close contact with directors of the club. I don't believe there is any appeal process here and that the decision is final. The only alternative would be for the club to stay at Boundary Park or seek a new site (which I believe to be OAFC's preference) and I do understand other sites are now being looked at and considered at, but am not privy to the details, which would in any case be highly confidential at this stage. As with the Vance Miller case, this will be a another high profile, expensive failure for Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group and it may be that resignations would be in order! Regards Councillor Steven Bashforth (Royton South Ward) It sounds very much like another council cock up to me!!!!!! This is very depressing! KTF Ah Bashforth, he was a real friend to the club wasn't he. What a nauseating reply. With friends like Bashforth, who needs enemies. Edited February 3, 2011 by singe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueJazzer Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Why do we actually need to build on the charity land? It's just a small patch when u actually weigh up the site as a whole. Just leave that bit alone?! It's not like it's stuck in the middle or anything. Isn't it the overgrown bit near the houses at Park Lane? The groundshare with Rochdale would do me fine. A symetrical stadium with a main entrance on each side, one for each club. It would/should mean more investment as two clubs pooling resources and hopefully two councils too. Would also make for a healthy rivalry. And if it's on the Oldham/Rochdale border at kingsway/newhey/milnrow sort of area, it would feel more oldhamish (to me) and further away from the mancs in failsworth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Ritchie Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Its not going to happen as the failsworth project not dead yet, the club have spent near on 5millon pounds to get where we are now Someone is getting rich off this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Why do we actually need to build on the charity land? It's just a small patch when u actually weigh up the site as a whole. Just leave that bit alone?! It's not like it's stuck in the middle or anything. Isn't it the overgrown bit near the houses at Park Lane? The groundshare with Rochdale would do me fine. A symetrical stadium with a main entrance on each side, one for each club. It would/should mean more investment as two clubs pooling resources and hopefully two councils too. Would also make for a healthy rivalry. And if it's on the Oldham/Rochdale border at kingsway/newhey/milnrow sort of area, it would feel more oldhamish (to me) and further away from the mancs in failsworth. It's the only part of the Failsworth site that could house a stadium due to existing power lines, proximity to the road and domestic dwellings - from Alan Hardy, Ian HIll and the Architect... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldhamathleticfailsworth Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) After reading the statement on OAFC official board I sent the following email to my local councillors Bashforth and Harrison: "Councillors, I write regarding today’s ruling by the Charity Commission with regards to the Charitable Land Swap in Failsworth. I quote from a council statement: “Oldham Council has expressed ‘disappointment’ at a new ruling from the Charity Commission”. Disappointment, disa-flipping-ppointment. Disappointment is not a word I am using for this decision. Disgusting is the clean one that I will share with you. This ruling nigh on kills off Oldham Athletic Football Club and I fear that Oldham’s last remaining professional sporting club will cease to exist in the very near future, and go the same way as the Oldham Roughyeds have had to go in becoming semi professional after being stitched up by Oldham Council. Does Oldham Council actually comprehend how important a role Oldham Athletic is to the awareness of the town by rest of the country. Every other week hundreds (sometimes thousands) of visitors come to our town purely because they are following their team to Oldham. They spend disposable income in our town! Not just at the football club but in the bars and pubs around the ground, in the newsagents getting their snacks for at the game, in the nightclubs and hotels if their trip involves an overnight stop! Do they even care!!! I fear not. The plan to swap the charitable land I believe was hatched by the council. They were confident that this would be a successful way to move the planning issues forward. Now this has failed, and I would like to know whether the failure was due to ignorance, negligence, or incompetence of our council officials. Which is it please? What are the people of Oldham paying for through their taxes. Is this to be another high profile failure of our elected officials as in the Vance Miller fiasco. Who’s head will roll for this one. Nobody’s I suspect! Can you urgently find out what moves Oldham council are planning to take on this issue. Is an appeal process an option, or can the charitable swap planned be amended as in any other planning application and re-submitted?" I have since received the following from Councillor Bashforth: Dear Sir, I cannot agree with you more on how badly this affair has been run, indeed although I have not yet had sight of the Charity Commission's report, I do understand that it is highly critical of the way Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group conducted themselves throughout the process. The importance of a viable well attended football club is not lost on the Oldham Labour Group who have pledged real support for the club when they are in a position to do so and the leader of our group has been, and remains in very close contact with directors of the club. I don't believe there is any appeal process here and that the decision is final. The only alternative would be for the club to stay at Boundary Park or seek a new site (which I believe to be OAFC's preference) and I do understand other sites are now being looked at and considered at, but am not privy to the details, which would in any case be highly confidential at this stage. As with the Vance Miller case, this will be a another high profile, expensive failure for Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group and it may be that resignations would be in order! Regards Councillor Steven Bashforth (Royton South Ward) It sounds very much like another council cock up to me!!!!!! This is very depressing! KTF I have spoken to Mark Preswich who is looking at this from the council, there are grounds for an appeal and that the charity commission are only going off the information which was provided to them Edited February 3, 2011 by oldhamathleticfailsworth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevesmitt Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 After reading the statement on OAFC official board I sent the following email to my local councillors Bashforth and Harrison: "Councillors, I write regarding today’s ruling by the Charity Commission with regards to the Charitable Land Swap in Failsworth. I quote from a council statement: “Oldham Council has expressed ‘disappointment’ at a new ruling from the Charity Commission”. Disappointment, disa-flipping-ppointment. Disappointment is not a word I am using for this decision. Disgusting is the clean one that I will share with you. This ruling nigh on kills off Oldham Athletic Football Club and I fear that Oldham’s last remaining professional sporting club will cease to exist in the very near future, and go the same way as the Oldham Roughyeds have had to go in becoming semi professional after being stitched up by Oldham Council. Does Oldham Council actually comprehend how important a role Oldham Athletic is to the awareness of the town by rest of the country. Every other week hundreds (sometimes thousands) of visitors come to our town purely because they are following their team to Oldham. They spend disposable income in our town! Not just at the football club but in the bars and pubs around the ground, in the newsagents getting their snacks for at the game, in the nightclubs and hotels if their trip involves an overnight stop! Do they even care!!! I fear not. The plan to swap the charitable land I believe was hatched by the council. They were confident that this would be a successful way to move the planning issues forward. Now this has failed, and I would like to know whether the failure was due to ignorance, negligence, or incompetence of our council officials. Which is it please? What are the people of Oldham paying for through their taxes. Is this to be another high profile failure of our elected officials as in the Vance Miller fiasco. Who’s head will roll for this one. Nobody’s I suspect! Can you urgently find out what moves Oldham council are planning to take on this issue. Is an appeal process an option, or can the charitable swap planned be amended as in any other planning application and re-submitted?" I have since received the following from Councillor Bashforth: Dear Sir, I cannot agree with you more on how badly this affair has been run, indeed although I have not yet had sight of the Charity Commission's report, I do understand that it is highly critical of the way Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group conducted themselves throughout the process. The importance of a viable well attended football club is not lost on the Oldham Labour Group who have pledged real support for the club when they are in a position to do so and the leader of our group has been, and remains in very close contact with directors of the club. I don't believe there is any appeal process here and that the decision is final. The only alternative would be for the club to stay at Boundary Park or seek a new site (which I believe to be OAFC's preference) and I do understand other sites are now being looked at and considered at, but am not privy to the details, which would in any case be highly confidential at this stage. As with the Vance Miller case, this will be a another high profile, expensive failure for Oldham council's Lib Dem/Conservative ruling group and it may be that resignations would be in order! Regards Councillor Steven Bashforth (Royton South Ward) It sounds very much like another council cock up to me!!!!!! This is very depressing! KTF From that reply it looks like we will not be able to appeal and that Failsworth is dead in the water. Our only option know is either re-devolpe BP, which we dont have the funds to do or find a new site fast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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