tGWB Posted April 11, 2022 Share Posted April 11, 2022 4 hours ago, kowenicki said: Fans aren’t gifting a combined £1m without a plan/goal. (It is a gift by the way. If you are giving it then don’t expect a return. A retrospective ‘share scheme’ is fanciful within this context (and would be worthless anyway)) Blitz isn’t our saviour. Why would he be? Surely the opposite suits him. The club is a headache that either goes away because someone pays his ridiculous price or it goes bust. One of those is far more likely than the other right now. The point of my original question was to seek an update regarding progress on lobbying/securing interest from prospective buyers. With no new buyer, willing to take a chance and buy the lot, we are ‘rearranging the deckchairs’. Sorry to be such a pessimist… not my usual style at all. Personally I don't think raising £1m is beyond our fanbase Saying that, it is a fanciful amount without a professionally constructed "what's in it for me" proposition and I would suggest clarity on who was managing any monies raised Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiseowl Posted April 11, 2022 Share Posted April 11, 2022 6 hours ago, oafc1955 said: If the money was to be used by OASF to buy the ground/club as part of a consortium I think they would definitely raise £1m and maybe even more. I mentioned before that there has to be some sort of recognition for your financial input.ie. a share type scheme that could be instigated at a later date. If you donated in £50/£100/£150 and were issued some sort of certificate for increments there of I would put in my ST money no doubt! I don't want to appear negative for the sake of it but there is a local case precedent here i.e. Oldham Rugby. They had a similar size fanbase to us at the time - and many diehard roughyeds duly stumped up their cash for "shares" - and they lost the lot. I`m sure there will be someone around who remembers the fine detail - i.e. so that whoever is looking after this on Latics' fans behalf can at least have some advance warning of how the rugby one went so wrong despite its honourable intentions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted April 11, 2022 Share Posted April 11, 2022 1 hour ago, wiseowl said: I don't want to appear negative for the sake of it but there is a local case precedent here i.e. Oldham Rugby. They had a similar size fanbase to us at the time - and many diehard roughyeds duly stumped up their cash for "shares" - and they lost the lot. I`m sure there will be someone around who remembers the fine detail - i.e. so that whoever is looking after this on Latics' fans behalf can at least have some advance warning of how the rugby one went so wrong despite its honourable intentions. How much did they raise? I would really like to know the full story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underdog Posted April 11, 2022 Share Posted April 11, 2022 The sad story of our rugby club makes me fearful for our footy team too. The failure to launch of 3? Stadium builds is another sad story. If we don't secure a stadium size home before 2031, I fear there won't be any land left. I remember looking into CBS models with asset locks, shares, EIS tax relief...I think as my memory is shot There are grants out there for the right set ups....or you branch out and add the set up. Portsmouth Trus did that. They were a CBS and launched a CIC (I think) to then purchase/'run the club bit when they got ownership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc1955 Posted April 11, 2022 Share Posted April 11, 2022 2 hours ago, underdog said: If we don't secure a stadium size home before 2031, I fear there won't be any land left. Why can’t our stay at BP be extended? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underdog Posted April 11, 2022 Share Posted April 11, 2022 3 minutes ago, oafc1955 said: Why can’t our stay at BP be extended? That is another option but requires both club owner and landlord to sort. Maybe we get both parts together, owned by one group by then too. Who knows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tGWB Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 12 hours ago, underdog said: The sad story of our rugby club makes me fearful for our footy team too. If we don't secure a stadium size home before 2031, I fear there won't be any land left. Morning underdog I thought Brassbank (Blitz & Gazal) owned both the land the stadium sits on and surrounding land as in car park and little Wembley ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 hour ago, tGWB said: Morning underdog I thought Brassbank (Blitz & Gazal) owned both the land the stadium sits on and surrounding land as in car park and little Wembley ? they do. There is a provision in place that it can only be used for sporting purposes until 2031 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underdog Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 2 hours ago, tGWB said: Morning underdog I thought Brassbank (Blitz & Gazal) owned both the land the stadium sits on and surrounding land as in car park and little Wembley ? Dave beat me too it. Cheers Dave We have to be mindful that Oldham has to somehow build 12800. Homes by 2037. Brownfield is being snapped up now with a beady eye on some of our green spaces. Even the 30 plus year failed golf course between Derker to Sholver will have a new 800 plus houses built on it...and that is the biggest place I can think of so far. So in my mind, we have to secure a stadium size location and put it in trust/asset lock. Secure a home for Footy and rugby clubs. Surrounding land like little Wembley and Plumpton clough has lapsed housing permission on them too. So possible we could see them disappear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tGWB Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 2 hours ago, Dave_Og said: they do. There is a provision in place that it can only be used for sporting purposes until 2031 31 minutes ago, underdog said: Dave beat me too it. Cheers Dave So in my mind, we have to secure a stadium size location and put it in trust/asset lock. Secure a home for Footy and rugby clubs. When you state the land can only be used for sporting purposes until 2031, who has the legal authority to enforce that or likewise extend it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kowenicki Posted April 12, 2022 Author Share Posted April 12, 2022 8 minutes ago, tGWB said: When you state the land can only be used for sporting purposes until 2031, who has the legal authority to enforce that or likewise extend it …particularly if there are no potential tenants. not sure if this is relevant: Forms of termination The most direct form of termination is by way of a signed deed between the land owner and all beneficiaries of the sporting rights. In practice, this is likely to be contingent on negotiating a release payment with the beneficiaries, which in our experience can typically be around 10% to 15% of the uplift in the value of the land. Alternative methods of termination are ‘abandonment’ or ‘exhaustion'. For example, sporting rights may be impliedly abandoned by their beneficiary if there is a long period of non-use and an intention for the sporting rights to be released. Alternatively, if the beneficiary expends the subject matter of the sporting right, as a result of which, for example, there is nothing left to hunt, it will be considered ‘exhausted’ and will no longer exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc1955 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 I’m not privy to the workings of this type of arrangement but surely the 2031 deadline could be extended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 38 minutes ago, tGWB said: When you state the land can only be used for sporting purposes until 2031, who has the legal authority to enforce that or likewise extend it This isn't aimed at you at all by the way... I think clearly establishing the facts and making sure they are readily available to anybody who takes the trouble to look could be a massive leap forward in galvanising the fanbase - I would really like OASF/PTB to do that. It's ridiculous that 19 years after some of the moves were made that are now absolutely fundamental to where the club finds itself now were made that they are so poorly known and understood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 4 minutes ago, Dave_Og said: This isn't aimed at you at all by the way... I think clearly establishing the facts and making sure they are readily available to anybody who takes the trouble to look could be a massive leap forward in galvanising the fanbase - I would really like OASF/PTB to do that. It's ridiculous that 19 years after some of the moves were made that are now absolutely fundamental to where the club finds itself now were made that they are so poorly known and understood. Agreed Dave, trouble is- relatively very few care about that level of detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 15 minutes ago, League one forever said: Agreed Dave, trouble is- relatively very few care about that level of detail. Now is the time - particularly if the fund raising is to get off with any momentum. I have submitted such a suggestion to OASF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tGWB Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 34 minutes ago, Dave_Og said: This isn't aimed at you at all by the way... I think clearly establishing the facts and making sure they are readily available to anybody who takes the trouble to look could be a massive leap forward in galvanising the fanbase - I would really like OASF/PTB to do that. It's ridiculous that 19 years after some of the moves were made that are now absolutely fundamental to where the club finds itself now were made that they are so poorly known and understood. Appreciate what you are saying Dave but 1 hour ago, tGWB said: When you state the land can only be used for sporting purposes until 2031, who has the legal authority to enforce that or likewise extend it Who has the legal authority to enforce it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, tGWB said: Appreciate what you are saying Dave but Who has the legal authority to enforce it A civil court Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick26 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 4 hours ago, Dave_Og said: they do. There is a provision in place that it can only be used for sporting purposes until 2031 Is there any scenario where Blitz could fund a new stadium on a brownfield site and then build 200+ houses on BP making umpteen millions . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, mick26 said: Is there any scenario where Blitz could fund a new stadium on a brownfield site and then build 200+ houses on BP making umpteen millions . He'd need some sort of magical powers to make umpteen millions from housing there. Let's face it - that's the ideal scenario Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dickie Down Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 21 hours ago, wiseowl said: I don't want to appear negative for the sake of it but there is a local case precedent here i.e. Oldham Rugby. They had a similar size fanbase to us at the time - and many diehard roughyeds duly stumped up their cash for "shares" - and they lost the lot. I`m sure there will be someone around who remembers the fine detail - i.e. so that whoever is looking after this on Latics' fans behalf can at least have some advance warning of how the rugby one went so wrong despite its honourable intentions. I had my £25 worth of shares. I think everyone knew they were just making a donation to their hobby. In terms of governance it was the point at which the club moved from being a members' club to a PLC and, therefore, less accountable. Super League was the beginning of the end, very like the Premiership for Latics. Never welcome at that party. On liquidation, the old club was unable to issue a final account and had fixed assets of only £4K. Stories abounded of players' taking the field uninsured, allegedly. What is undisputable is that no set of accounts has ever detailed the sale of Watersheddings. That sorry tale, and what has followed for the rugby, tells me that securing the ground and that strong and accountable supporter involvement are essential. Ideally, I would like both clubs to play at Boundary Park and create a real hub for professional sport in Oldham and to see it becoming a magnet for sports' minded people in our town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteG Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 hour ago, mick26 said: Is there any scenario where Blitz could fund a new stadium on a brownfield site and then build 200+ houses on BP making umpteen millions . Why would Blitz want to fund a new stadium, he can just count down the years to 2031 which will be here before we know it and then build on BP anyway without funding any new stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaddyexile84 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 41 minutes ago, PeteG said: Why would Blitz want to fund a new stadium, he can just count down the years to 2031 which will be here before we know it and then build on BP anyway without funding any new stadium. He wouldn't, but bizarrely there are still people who think he has the slightest interest in helping the club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteG Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 4 minutes ago, Chaddyexile84 said: He wouldn't, but bizarrely there are still people who think he has the slightest interest in helping the club Would those people also believe that Blitz might help them individually as well and therefore they peddle his BS that he's interested in helping the club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yarddog73 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 10 minutes ago, PeteG said: Would those people also believe that Blitz might help them individually as well and therefore they peddle his BS that he's interested in helping the club? Plenty in that camp as well, no doubt he 'helped out' when we were up against it in the Corney years but let's face it he was only protecting his investment - the fact someone was mug enough to take the major loss making part of his interest away only strengthened his position and muddied the situation further which could of been just what he wanted. Like him or not he is probably the one man who could put an end to all this and bring it all under control again, surely this wouldn't be too much to ask of the man, I can't see how a wealthy man like him would want to leave behind that sort of legacy for the sake of a few quid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 If Simon Blitz aim is to make money from property then he is not going to wait 9 years for the lease to run down then have to go through the hassle of planning permission then paying the cost to bulldoze Boundary Park and evicting not just OAFC but the OEC and the gym and then building houses. If he wants to make money in property he will find an alternative site build on it and take the profit before 2031. Hes not going to build on Boundary Park not because he wants to help the club but because it's too much of a hassle for him. He'd much prefer to sell the land/ground take his money and let someonelse take it off his hands. I also think that both the ground and the club will be in other people's hands by 2031 so at the moment I don't think it's that bigger deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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